Mark C Lee interviews Nick Pope - one of the world’s leading experts and researchers on UFOs.

Mark C Lee interviews Nick Pope -  one of the world’s leading experts and researchers on UFOs.

Introduction

 I first came across the name Nick Pope when doing research for my next book – UFOs and Rock. He seemed to be the number one guy to speak to with regards to UK UFOs especially as he had worked for a number of years at the Ministry Of Defence where he was in charge of the so called British X Files, investigating hundreds of UFO sightings that date back to the 1950s. In fact Nick gave me hope that there may be more to the UFO movement than dodgy acid trips and trailer trash flashbacks. In essence he has given credibility and gravitas to a much maligned field, and well if Nick Pope, ex MOD and intelligent observer, thinks that there’s more to it than hoaxes, disinformation and the planet Venus then maybe “they” are actually out there….somewhere!

Questions;  

Good afternoon Nick and thank you for agreeing to this interview.

Can you give our readers a little background to who you are and what you do?

I worked for the MoD for 21 years and while I had several different jobs at various levels in the course of my career, I’m best-known for having run MoD’s UFO project – something I did from 1991 to 1994. I left MoD in 2006 and I now work as a broadcaster and journalist, specializing in stories on the unexplained, conspiracy theories, sci-fi and fringe science.

What’s the most convincing case for a UFO being a non man made physical aircraft of some sort?

Probably a wave of sightings we had over the UK for a period of around six hours on March 30 and 31, 1993. It’s difficult to be sure of the total number of witnesses, because while dozens of people made reports to MoD, some contacted the police, UFO groups and the media, while other witnesses stayed silent. Of the reports I received and investigated at MoD, one of the most interesting came from a patrol of military police at RAF Cosford, who saw the UFO fly directly over the Air Force Base. But the most compelling came from the meteorological officer at a second military base, RAF Shawbury. He saw a large delta-shaped UFO moving slowly towards the base, about 200 feet above the ground, at a speed of no more than 30 or 40 mph.  He saw the UFO fire a narrow beam of light (like a laser) at the ground and saw the light sweeping backwards and forwards across the field beyond the perimeter fence, as if it were looking for something.  He heard an unpleasant low frequency humming sound coming from the craft and said he could feel as well as hear this.  He estimated the size of the craft to be midway between a C-130 transport aircraft and a Boeing 747.  Then he told me that the light beam had retracted in an unnatural way and that the craft had suddenly accelerated away to the horizon many times faster than a military aircraft.  Here was an experienced Air Force officer with eight years of service, who regularly saw military aircraft and helicopters, yet said this was unlike anything he’d seen in his life. We launched a full investigation, of course, but the sightings remain unexplained to this day.

The Rendlesham Forest incident – This case seems to be still unsolved. What is your take on what exactly happened here? Did a landing take place as Jim Penniston suggested, or was it all just the Orford Ness lighthouse disorientating US soldiers in the forest? (To be honest I just don’t think the lighthouse theory works to well especially as Colonel Halt has stated that the craft shone beams of light down).

It was certainly reported to MoD as a landing and the investigation was handled on this basis – e.g. my predecessors made a scientific assessment of the radiation levels recorded at the site where the UFO had been seen on the ground. As with the 1993 sightings I mentioned, the Rendlesham Forest incident remains unexplained to this day. It certainly wasn’t the lighthouse. Even the local forester who first suggested this doesn’t think the lighthouse could fool people for so long, over two separate nights. In any case, you can’t see the lighthouse from most of the locations where the UFO was seen and in the couple of places where you can, the angles are all wrong. None of the other skeptical theories (practical jokes, a psyop to test the reaction of the guards, drug-induced hallucinations, etc.) pan out either, so we’re left with a genuine mystery.

US Press Club meeting? How significant was this and what was the outcome?

Are the US or other governments covering up the truth? I know you’ve gone on record stating that you believe that it’s more of a question of governments being embarrassed about admitting that there’s things in our airspace that we don’t know what they are, but do you think there is a covert agenda?

I can only speak for the position in the UK and so far as that’s concerned, I’ve seen no evidence of a covert agenda, aside from the policy (publicly exposed many years ago in some documents acquired after a Freedom of Information Act request) of downplaying MoD’s interest in UFOs and downplaying the true extent of the research and investigation that the Department used to do on the subject. There have been several UFO-related events at The National Press Club: Steven Greer’s Disclosure Project press conference was the first. Steve Bassett has hosted two or three; Leslie Kean and James Fox organized one; Robert Hastings put one on. All were important events and generated mainstream media coverage to varying extents.

If the extra-terrestrial theory is correct why are we being visited and for what purpose?

Well, I don’t know that the extra-terrestrial theory is correct. While I can’t rule it out and while there’s some intriguing evidence, there’s nothing that I’d characterize as definitive ‘you can take that to the bank’ proof. If we are dealing with extraterrestrials, I think most – if not all – assessments of the ‘alien agenda’ are hopelessly anthropocentric: we’re simply copying and pasting human thinking, so we end up with clichéd human ideas about what might happen after first contact with extraterrestrials. We have alien invasion at one extreme and an invitation to join some sort of ‘Galactic Federation’ at the other. About the only prediction I’ll make is that it won’t turn out how we think it will.

What do you think of the theory that maybe the UFOs and occupants that have been seen are really just us from the future and that we have time travelled back in time for some purpose?

It’s a fascinating theory and it deals nicely with one of the classic ufological pieces of anthropocentrism, namely the question of why most UFO occupants look essentially humanoid. The argument, I suppose, would be that the grays (and maybe the Nordics) are what human beings evolve into. That said, I’m pretty cautious about ideas like this and I think we’re kidding ourselves if we think there’s any meaningful evidence to support them. It’s an intriguing theory, but nothing more. And ideas of technologically advanced humans coming back in time to save their dying race by harvesting genetic material from us (and maybe trying to salvage their lost humanity) are sci-fi clichés.

I see that you’re getting into the important new field of Exo- Politics could you just explain to our reader what this is and why it may be of importance in the future.

I’m not sure I’m “getting into” exopolitics. I’ve spoken at various exopolitical conferences, but I disagree with many of their beliefs (they present as certainties things which simply aren’t proven) and I’ve managed to upset some of the UK exopolitics folk by writing a newspaper article where I referred to exopolitics as being the “militant wing” of ufology! If anything, I meant this as a compliment, in terms of them being more bullish and crusading than most ufologists, but some people took my comment the wrong way. If they could lose their tendency to state speculation as if it were fact (along with their habit of trying to tie in ufology with 9/11 conspiracy theories and other ideas about the New World Order) I think they’d have an interesting and relevant approach: i.e. let’s forget debating what UFOs are, and whether we’re being visited, on the basis that you’re really not going to change anyone’s mind. Rather, let’s assume we are being visited and ask what our response should be. Now that’s interesting.

What do you think about the possibility that the UFOs people are seeing are man made from reverse engineered technology taken from recovered extra terrestrial craft?

Again, I can’t rule it out, but despite some unsubstantiated stories from alleged whistleblowers, there’s no real evidence to back up the theory. And I’m going to go out on a limb here: I think there’s something a little depressing about these sorts of theories. They’re disparaging to human ingenuity and spirit. Why can’t we accept that we might be clever enough to have designed the stealth fighter ourselves? Why do we think we were too stupid to have built the pyramids and that aliens must have done it for us, or helped us? 

What is the most out there UFO theory that you have come across?

Hmm, where to begin? There are plenty of ‘out there’ cases (and ufologists!), but theories … I think the whole Nazi flying saucer genre would be my pick; the idea that Hitler secretly developed disc-shaped craft and fled with this and other technology to a base in Antarctica, or wherever. All this, of course, is going to get another boost when the movie Iron Sky comes out.

Nick, what music do you listen to?

David Bowie, Elton John, Siouxie and the Banshees, Amy Winehouse, The Killers, Eminem, Nicki Minaj – and a whole lot of other bands and singers.

What are your favourite books?

Classics, with an emphasis on classic sci-fi: Nineteen Eighty-Four, Steppenwolf, The War of the Worlds, Brave New World, The Day of the Triffids, The Time Machine. Also, Tom Clancy’s thrillers, Stephen King’s horror books and Anne Rice’s vampire chronicles.

What sports are you into?

At international level, anything England are playing in: football, rugby, cricket, etc. But first and foremost is football (or soccer, as I have to call it in America), whether it’s an international match or a club game. I support Arsenal, but I like to watch any good game, irrespective of who’s playing. Sadly, I haven’t played sport myself for years. Here’s an interesting piece of personal sporting trivia: I went to the same school as Jonny Wilkinson, so we’d have played rugby on the same pitch, albeit not at the same time, in view of the age difference.

What about your favourite film?

If I can pick only one, I’ll go for Contact.

Guinness, Lager, Bitter or Absinthe?

Lager.

Rolling Stones or The Beatles?

The Rolling Stones.

What are your plans for 2012?

I recently relocated to California and I’m going to be doing a lot more TV work, which will probably see me in a wide range of roles, varying from co-creator of some drama, through to presenting and contributing to various documentaries. I’ll also be carrying on with freelance journalism for various newspapers and magazines, along with promotional work for film companies in relation to the release of new sci-fi movies. It’s already shaping up to be a very busy year.

Will the world still be here come 31st December?

Yes. Despite the tension over Iran’s nuclear program, predictions about a false flag alien invasion at the Olympics and theories about the Mayan calendar, we’ll still be here at the end of the year.

What do think about the Ancient Alien hypothesis that this planet has been visited for 1000s of years and may have even been genetically engineered/modified by extra terrestrials?

My wife is a physical anthropologist and from what I understand, there’s nothing in human development that can’t be explained by the processes of evolution. We don’t need Ancient Aliens (though I’m fond of the eponymous TV series) to explain any of this. Charles Darwin did it well enough all those years ago and his model still holds true.

Where can people find out more about you?

My www.nickpope.net website has extensive material about my government work and my more recent media work.

When are you next speaking in the US?

I’m drastically reducing my conference appearances, due to the pressure of other business. About the only two invitations I’ve accepted for 2012 are the Dreamland Festival in Nashville (May 18-20) and the 2012 MUFON International Symposium in Cincinnati (August 3-5). I may do one or two others, but that’s it for now.

Thanks again for your time.

Mark Christopher Lee

Mark C Lee interviews world famous UFO author Nick Redfern

Mark C Lee interviews UFO researcher and best selling author Nick Redfern

Hi Nick thanks for agreeing to the interview. Could you please introduce yourself to our readers?

Nick: Well, I’m originally from England, but I live on the fringes of Dallas, Texas. I work as an author – I’ve written about twenty-five books - lecturer, and journalist, and mainly focus on paranormal mysteries: UFOs, Bigfoot, the Loch Ness Monster, Roswell; things like that. But, I also do a lot of other stuff: I do quite a bit of writing for Penthouse, some ghost-writing for other authors, and website work for various companies in fields ranging from law to sex and horror films to exotic pets. Sometimes the exotic pets and the sex might be part of the same story LOL. I also wrote a book called Celebrity Secrets, which was about how the FBI spent years watching celebrities like John Lennon, Jimi Hendrix, Marilyn Monroe, Frank Sinatra, Abbott and Costello and loads more.

You have a book out called “Contactees”, could you tell us a bit about it?

Nick: Contactees is a controversial book that looks at claims of people who say they have met aliens, and specifically aliens who look just like us. The story is a wild one, and has as much to do with possible real encounters with ETs as it does drug-induced states, wishful-thinking, certifiable madness, conmen, jokers, and even top secret government manipulation. Everything about the world of the paranormal is weird, but some things are much weirder than others, and these –like the Contactees - are the ones I like to write about. I don’t want to bother at all with the bland side of the paranormal. Nor all that “love and light” supernatural crap – which I totally loathe. I hate, hate, hate it.

Is there really evidence out there to substantiate alien abductions or is it just people with sleep paralysis spinning a good yarn?

Nick: Well, I think people do have these experiences, and most people – I believe – are honest in their claims. The big question is whether they are experiencing something external to them, or something internal to their subconscious etc. It may be – at the end of the day – a combination of both. But, I do believe, fully, that there is an absolutely genuine UFO phenomenon among us that does interact with us – abductions, contacts etc – but I don’t think we have come even close to fully understanding its true nature or intent.

Are there people today still being abducted? – What do you think the purpose is?

How does the abduction scenario fit in with Cattle mutilations, are they connected?

Nick: People do still report abductions, yes. But, the subject isn’t such a big thing in popular-culture as it was, say, ten or fifteen years ago. I think the purpose is that there is some phenomenon – definitively alien, in some sense – that interacts with us for the purpose of achieving some change of mindset in the individual. Cattle mutes? Nothing to do with aliens, in my view. This, I believe, is all about the government stealthily checking the food-chain for emerging, very dangerous viruses, like next-generation equivalents of “Mad-Cow Disease” etc. The UFO subject acts as a good cover-story for anyone who might stumble on such mutilated and dissected animals. There’s a real mystery to the mutes, but I think it’s a dark and disturbing one of government, not of ETs.

Monster Hunting – I guess there must be still species out there that are yet to be discovered but what about those species such as the Chupacabra, which may have a paranormal as well as physical element to them, what experience, have you had of them?

Nick: I’ve been to Puerto Rico on a number of expeditions looking for the Chupacabra, which is where most of the reports surface from. I’ve spoken to a lot of people who claim to have seen the creature – described as a kind of monkey-like animal with vicious-looking spikes down its head and neck – like a punk-rock Mohawk. But, like so many of these things, I haven’t yet captured one, stumbled on one, etc. Maybe one day!

Which leads me on to one of my all time favourite books of any genre the magnificent tome that is “Three Men Seeking Monsters”. Did you have a good time researching that one? How many pubs did you frequent on your fortean road trip? I particularly liked the way you started each chapter with a quote by my fave band The Ramones. I guess you’re a fan then?

Nick: I always have a good time doing research when I’m on the road. How many pubs do I hit or have I hit? I have no idea – as many as are needed to fuel me! If they sell ice-cold Tennents Super or Carlsberg Special Brew, well, then that’s even better. Growing up in England, going down the pub is what everyone does to socialize on weekends. Much better than going out to eat. Just fill yourself with lager, piss it away, and start all over again. The Ramones are my all-time favourite band. I first heard them when I was about twelve, and was hooked. I liked the image – the hair, the leather jackets, the guitars held below the waist, the speed of the songs, everything. Plus, if you liked them at the beginning, then you liked them at the end because they never changed. I hate bands that change their style or change their music. Some people call it progressing, but I don’t. I’m very glad they stayed the same from start to finish. Plus, I like the image of a band being four people – like a gang. That was one of the reasons why me and my mates liked the Ramones – we were like a gang that hung out on the streets and did stupid things, listened to music etc as teenagers. They might have been from New York, but you could still identify with them and the song subjects. I think their three best albums are Too Tough to Die, Subterranean Jungle, and Pleasant Dreams, although a lot of people knock Dreams for being too poppy, but I like it, and the Ramones had a definitive love and flair for classic pop – but they distorted it in a brilliant way with speed and punk guitar. Of the three, Too Tough is the winner. That album is masterful and bleak. I used to go and see them whenever they would come to the city of Birmingham, England and the gigs were crazy and great.

What’s your favourite Ramones track?

Nick: That’s easy: Psycho Therapy. I love that song! It sounds just like its subject-matter: crazy, deranged and out of control. Plus, the video is excellent and I like the siren at the beginning. But, there are plenty of other good ones too: Pet Sematary, Tomorrow She Goes Away, Pinhead (particularly in the 80s and 90s when they played it really fast), Sitting in my Room, The KKK Took My Baby Away, Warthog, Endless Vacation, Go Home Ann, and I think their version of Tom Waits’ I Don’t Want To Grow Up is excellent. I like their cover of Motorhead’s R.A.M.O.N.E.S too. I don’t have a least favourite song that springs to mind, but I do have a least liked album: 1989’s Brain Drain. For me, that was the sound of a band that had lost its direction, going through the motions, and ready to implode. But, fortunately, they didn’t, and from when C.J. joined in late ’89 after Dee Dee quit, I thought they really rediscovered their excitement, and their last seven years were very good. They definitely stopped at the right time, although it’s good to see that Marky is still flying the flag and playing. His post-Ramones stuff is very good.  I have met more than a few people who can’t take that constant high-speed, high-volume barrage, but I love it.

What other bands do you like? What are you listening to at the moment?

Nick: I mainly listen to punk – new and old - but I also like a lot of other stuff: Motorhead, Oasis, late 70s new-wave, the Stone Roses, the Macc Lads, and all those ‘60s girl bands like the Crystals, the Ronettes, and the Shangri-Las. Plus, a couple of my all-time favorites are one-hit wonders, like the Photos. They were a great UK new-wave band of the late ‘70s and early ‘80s whose first album is a masterpiece. I probably play that at least once a week. I wish they had gotten huge, but they didn’t. Right now, I’m listening to Bad Sports’ Kings of the Weekend, and last night had a good blast of Life After Sundown by Ghoultown, whose singer, Lyle Blackburn, is a mate of mine.

Have you ever played in a band? Maybe you could make a guest appearance one day with my band – the pocket gods!

Nick: Not really. Just fucked around. But I do play electric guitar, so yeah I don’t mind getting up and playing with your band. But it would have to be fast, loud, no solos, and an absolute maximum of three chords – or preferably just two bar-chords, which is all you really need, anyway, to play good music. And no-one can hold their guitars above their waist. And no shirts and collars, only t-shirts. And no shoes, only Converse All-Stars. And no chatting between songs. But everything else – maybe – is good.

What’s the weirdest thing that’s ever happened to you?

Nick: God, loads of stuff, most of it pretty surreal. Getting grilled by unsmiling airport security staff about some Bigfoot plaster-casts of footprints I had in my suitcase once, and which for some stupid and unfathomable reason they were worried about. Smoking something weird – the exact content of which was never really made clear to me - on a Native American reservation while trying to conjure up a shape-shifting Skinwalker. Driving around Puerto Rico’s El Yunque rain-forest in a jeep, chasing vampires, while Sham 69 boomed out the car’s speakers. Getting mistaken for a Man in Black. Taking part in a séance at Roswell, New Mexico to try and contact the dead crew from the Roswell “UFO” crash. I also hung out for a few days in the desert a few years ago with VH1’s Real and Chance, which was a good laugh.

Do you believe in an afterlife of some form?

Nick: Well, that’s a difficult one. I don’t deny the possibility that there could be an afterlife – although I certainly don’t dwell on it, or even think about it, unless it’s brought up. But, what pisses me off is the arrogance of organized religion, where one religion will say there definitely is a Heaven and a Hell. Another will say that reincarnation is the answer. Another says something else. They, clearly, can’t all be correct. But it’s this issue of each of them being sure they are absolutely right and everyone else is absolutely wrong that angers me. Mainstream, regulated religion has become a tool of controlling people via fear and guilt. It’s actually become less about exploring the potential mysteries of life after death. Could there be life after death? Yes, I think there could. But, that whole, specific issue has been hijacked by power-nuts who want to use it as a tool of fear and control. I have no time for people like this – they are pure, absolute evil. And they are total loons too. Like most people, I have had occasional experiences – after someone close has died – that are weird and make me wonder if some essence briefly came back from...well, somewhere. But, maybe it’s just our subconscious trying to help us come to terms with death. Or, even a bit of both maybe. I just don’t know. I wish I did. We all think about these things from time to time, but it’s without doubt life’s biggest mystery of all.

Stella, Bud, Absinthe or Single Malt?

Nick: Carlsberg Special Brew, Tennents Super, Margaritas, hot tea, chocolate milkshakes, and vodka. Don’t try them altogether, though.

What’s your favourite ever film and why?

Nick: Without doubt the 1957 film, Night of the Demon, starring Dana Andrews and Peggy Cummins. Although Niall MacGinnis totally steals the show with his portrayal of the bad guy, Julian Carswell. This is an excellent, very atmospheric, black and white film about demonology in England. It’s a classic old-time, spooky horror, which are the types of film I like. I watch horror stuff more than anything else. I love zombie films, providing they are done good. There’s a lot of crap zombie stuff out there too, though, unfortunately. Some of my other favourite films are The Ninth Gate, with Johnny Depp; Pan’s Labyrinth; Dead of Night; and Plague of the Zombies.

Could you tell us a bit about your recent book “Science Fiction Secrets”?  What struck a chord (D minor a sad one) was the bit on that Lone Gunmen episode which had a plot involving a government-backed terrorist flying a plane into the twin towers in New York. I’ve recently watched it again and it is uncanny. Do you think it be can be put down to pure coincidence – a random event – or something else?

Nick: Yeah, that was very weird. The Lone Gunmen was a short-lived spin-off series from The X-Files. And the very first episode was about an aircraft flying into the World Trade Center, but where the event was actually being carried out by a computer-hacker who takes control of the aircraft on behalf of shadowy forces who were going to blame the attack on Middle Eastern forces and use the Trade Center attack as a reason for attacking the Middle East. What’s interesting is that this episode was filmed and aired before 9/11. I kind of think it’s one of those odd coincidences. But, maybe it’s more. Unfortunately, nothing is ever clear-cut in this field!

Do you think that there has been a conspiracy to cover up the knowledge of extra terrestrial life or has it all been disinformation put out to divert attention from secret military projects?

Nick: I think it’s both. I think there are some UFO incidents which are clearly evidence of “something else” interacting with us. But, equally, there are some cases where I think we can suggest these things are secret military aircraft of an advanced nature. Look at all the weird drones flying around now, or landing in Iran even. They look very weird. In a few years, it’s going to be difficult to know which are our UFOs and which are...theirs.

What’s the most far out UFO theory that you’ve heard? Have you seen a UFO? I know that in your book “A Covert Agenda” you state that your father had seen one. How did that inspire you?

Nick: As for the most far-out theory, that’s easy. I wrote a book in 2010 called Final Events, which was a study of a think-tank group in government that believed rather than being extraterrestrial, the UFO phenomenon has demonic origins. And they meant that literally: The Devil, Hell, Armageddon, the whole thing. It was a fascinating thing to research, and demonstrates how the subject can nurture belief systems of a very controversial kind. Nope, I’ve never seen a UFO! My dad worked on radar for the British Royal Air Force when he was called up for National Service in 1950, and was involved in a couple of UFO incidents, where very fast-moving, high-flying objects were tracked on the radar. He told me this when I was a kid. It definitely got me interested in the subject, and did inspire me to look deeper. Not just because it was my dad, but because he was trained in the military on radar. He knew his stuff, in other words. He still talks about it to this day, if asked. But, he doesn’t dwell on it, and neither do I. Just one of those weird things.

Remote viewing. This one has always Fox Muldered me. Do you know anything about it and if so what is it and how does it work?

Nick: Yeah, it’s basically the idea of using the mind or the “soul” to, in essence, astrally leave the body and travel to another location where you can “see” what’s going on. The CIA researched this for years. It’s known as Remote-Viewing, but a more accurate term would be “Psychic Spying.” The CIA tried to train its agents for years to do this. And, intriguingly, it did seem to work at times. The big problem, though, was that it was unpredictable. I do believe it’s a real phenomenon, but harnessing and controlling right when you want it, that is the big problem.

Dawkins, Darwin or Ancient Aliens?

Nick: It’s hard to know, and sometimes, after a hard day of writing, it’s hard to care, too!

Have you seen the film Spinal Tap? If so have you ever had any tap moments?

Nick: Yes, of course I have seen it! Nope, not had any specific Tap moments that I can think of. Although, I did get lost behind a stage at a UFO gig once, I have been to Stonehenge many times, and all my amps do, of course, go up to 11!

What are your plans for the rest of this year?

Nick: I have a few new books out: The World’s Weirdest Places; The Pyramids and the Pentagon; Monster Diary; and Wild Man. I wouldn’t mind actually doing some more ghost-writing too. Maybe ghost-write the autobiography of some legendary punk star. I would love to do something like that. So, if there’s one reading this and is interested, get in touch! No wishy-washy musicians though. By wishy-washy, I mean everything that is not punk.

Will the world end come 31 December 2012 or will we all awake the following morning with heads like a fight?

Nick: Prophecies never, ever come true. Look at Nostradamus: It all comes down to how people interpret prophecies. Anyone can make a case that people have prophesized things correctly, but it’s always after the fact. And if the prophecy doesn’t come true, they just say the date was wrong, and push it forward ten years or whatever. No-one needs to worry about all that 2012 stuff. I’m totally certain that in 2013 the world will be just like it is now – screwed up, over-populated, fat and diabetic, medicated to the eyeballs, engaging in endless wars in the Middle East that no-one really understands, and addicted to watching vacuous birds on the telly with far too much time on their hands, but with an admittedly good amount of junk in their trunk. But it won’t be the end of the world. Unless, of course, there is some nut who wants to try and make the prophecy come true, which is probably the only danger to worry about: Some fool who thinks he’s doing right by making something happen. But that’s not some supernatural fulfilment of a prophecy. That’s just a nut on the loose who needs a good kicking and taking out of circulation.

Do you have a karaoke song or what would you sing if I forced you to with a big stick.

Nick: You wouldn’t have to force me. I don’t mind making a fool of myself! I would have to sing the Undertones’ classic Teenage Kicks. Aside from being one of the best songs ever written in the history of music, it would make a good one for Karaoke.

I see you’re now resident of the US in Dallas, Texas how’s that going? What do you miss about ol’ Blighty apart from the rain, the road works, the politicians, Simon Cowell (or did we send him your way) and milky tea?

Nick: Well, I don’t miss the tea, as I can get it right here: Good old British PG Tips! I like my tea hot, full of milk, and three heaped teaspoons of sugar. I can drink tea all day – and do! I like living in the Dallas area. I’ve been here about 12 years, and been coming over since ‘98. But, the heat does sometimes get to me, and yes, I do miss the rain! Cowell? Nah, I couldn’t care less. I don’t miss the pubs because I actually get back to England quite often, so I always meet up with my old mates and we go down the boozer. It’s instantly just like old times, no need for fancy introductions, or group hugs or any such nonsense. Just say “Alright, lads!” hit the town and have a good laugh. Of course, if I didn’t get back often I would miss it. But, getting back a lot means I don’t develop that missing things attitude. I do miss English chocolate though, and also Fish and Chips which is the greatest food on the planet.

To find out more about Nick check out his excellent website and buy his brilliant books!

 http://www.nickredfern.com/

Heading Home, Losing My Religion And The Mad Mongolian Seaside Experience

HEADING HOME, LOSING MY RELIGION AND THE MAD MONGOLIAN SEASIDE EXPERIENCE

“Now we hang ourselves on Darwin’s rope”

“Survival Of The Shittest” by The Pocket Gods

It was gig time and off to old Londinium we went. Nige, Bert and Kathy Ann went in the van full of our equipment and I got a lift off mad Bart who fancied a rock n roll trip to England. I just wished he had learnt to drive before we set off. My God that was one scary journey.

We went via Brussels where we stayed overnight at his girlfriend’s flat. We were stupid and lazy and couldn’t be bothered to unload his car with all my stuff in the boot and anyway as this was one of the poshest parts of Brussels we’d thought it would be safe. Bart woke me up in the early hours of the morning looking really worried and saying he had some really bad news. He took me to the window and said his car had been broken into. He had heard it and ran outside but it was too late a gang of youths had taken almost everything in the car. I couldn’t believe it I was gutted and just laughed in a final act of desperation – that was all my worldly goods all my frickin clothes, books, CDs, personal stuff all gone. I didn’t have much in terms of worldly possessions as my parents had seen to that by chucking out any old stuff from my childhood including school photos – they were nice like that. I remember coming home from university in the holidays and found that they had let my room to students and had chucked all my stuff out.

What was the point in going on? If there was a God why was he such a cunt to me? If I was supposed to be special why keep me down in the gutter. I was suicidal for a bit but then clung to the slight hope that the gig in London might just be the big one that gets us on the track to the bigtime. Pipe dreams that’s all they were as I realise now. I was just like those sad drunks in that Eugene O’Brien play – “The Iceman Cometh”. I was a sad skinny drunk clinging on to the desperate hope of salvation – like all those minions who do the National Lottery every week.

We picked ourselves up and headed to Oostende where the ferry was sailing from and we had time to see his friend Inga whom we met in the woods. He told me she fancied me so I thought that’s scary but nice. Anyway we ended up going to a Social Club where Inga was trying to raise the dead spirits of the Mongolian Shamen in a seaside town in Northern Belgium. We all stood round in a circle chanting some Mongolian bollox and disappointingly we didn’t raise any Shamen but I did let rip a few brown clouds in nervous anticipation of meeting dead Mongolian dudes. Seriously this sort of thing would only happen in Belgium.

There was no romance in the air and we headed back to blighty via a rusty old ferry. We got back to St Albans, my old stomping ground, and stayed with Bill. Kathy and crew had already arrived and were staying at Mac’s house in a bit more luxury than me and Bart at Bill’s flat. Kathy Ann thought that Mac must be gay when seeing how tidy and clean his house was, but I think like all the other blokes around he had the hots for her. Anyway, I knew he wasn’t gay as I’d seen his prized porn collection! We played a warm up gig that night at the Horn in St Albans which went really well and people commented on how tight we sounded so I guess those months of rehearsing like mad had paid off.

RED ALERT SNACKS ARE LOW RED ALERT SNACKS ARE LOW

OVER THE BORDERLINE, THE END AND REBUILD

“I want to live in the land of giants.”

“The Land Of The Giants” by The Pocket Gods

We arrived at the world famous Borderline venue the next morning to load up our gear and find a frickin’ parking space which is easier said than done in the West End of London. It was quite awe inspiring walking in there and reading all the posters of the famous dudes who had played there; Jeff Buckley, Bob Dylan, Sisters of Mercy and also Oasis who filmed their video here for Cigarettes & Alcohol.

The gig went really well and we played out of our skins and looked the part of hungry wannabe rock stars. The man from Telstar records was there at the back and I could see dodgy manager Kev chatting to him whilst we were playing our set. What were they talking about? It must be good or he wouldn’t say anything. He seems to be enjoying it I think. Wow maybe this is it. I was having a massive adrenalin rush the kind you only get when playing rock n roll and is better than any artificial drug I’ve ever taken and I guess it’s enhanced  a bit by my manic depression which gives me massive waves of energy sometimes…but the downside is the lows are lower than the low countries.

We came off stage and congratulated each other and then we all felt a mixture of excited anticipation and a bit sad as common sense was kicking in a bit and was telling us that this was probably the last time we would all play together unless we got signed up here and now.

Manager Kev came rushing backstage, well a little corridor were Oasis hung out in their vid snorting coke off a bunch of tarts, and shouted at us; “WE’VE DONE IT WE’VE FUCKING DONE IT. WE’RE SIGNED. HE WANTS US”. Wow we thought that’s cool and then we started asking for a bit more detail. Kevin just said the same thing over and over again;

“WE’VE DONE IT WE’VE FUCKING DONE IT. WE’RE SIGNED. HE WANTS US.”

 The only thing he did say was that he had to call him tomorrow to discuss the details. Tomorrow came and both me and Nige tried to call him at wok but he wasn’t returning our calls. We smelt a rat a big fat KEV RAT and we both felt utterly stupid in that we had asked him back to be our manager as we knew he was dodgy.

Anyway, I decided to wait no more and I called the guy from Telstar Records myself. He told me that although he liked the band he just wanted to sign up the drummer for a new all girl band he was putting together – I later found out they were called The Bush The Tree And Me. I felt gutted and betrayed and bad that I’d wasted 4 months of everyone’s time on this stupid idea of making it. We hadn’t made it, and it was my entire fault. We told Kathy Ann about what the Telstar man had said, but she declined their offer as she was happy in Belgium with her girl and her dog called Muff. Nigel and Bert went back to Antwerp to pursue their own new musical projects – The Low Countries and Zaam, respectively.

I was homeless, had no money, no clothes, no job, and no things at all as they’d all been stolen by teenage Belgium crack whores. I couldn’t go home to my parents as all that waited for me there was a horny old man of a father and a fucking bitch of a mom. I did think about killing myself – maybe a tube train as I was still in London – or under a bus – but I just couldn’t be arsed and had no motivation even to end it all.

In the end my good friend Al from Tower Records said I could stay with him and his parents in Willesden until I got myself sorted. These kind people saved my life and showed me humanity and what it was like to be part of a normal caring loving family. They fed me and lent me some money to get some clothes and I used the time to get my head together and work out what to do next. I would have jams with Al’s dad Benny who would get his harmonica out and start playing old Irish folk songs. We’d also share a few tins of Harp lager together. Therese, Al’s mum, fattened me up with her lovely Irish hospitality and home cooking.

Those roast dinners on a Sunday were the stuff of legend. I did get my shit together and got my old job back at Tower Records and Al’s folks lent me some money for a deposit on a place to rent which Wil, another friend from Tower had kindly let to me.  Since then they have been my surrogate parents and I’d try and pop down and see them on a Sunday from time to time to soak up their pure goodness that they radiated. Unlike all my family apart from Jade my niece, they came to my wedding and were very proud to see me married and happy that I’d got my life sorted.

It was a sad day when Benny died last year. I had to go to the funeral in Willesden though it was the snowiest day of the year… there were no buses and the trains were disrupted but I just had to be there and pay my last respects and also be there for Therese and Al.. I had to set off really early and paid for taxis but I just made it on time. Therese came up to me crying saying; “You’ve lost your Daddy. You’ve lost your Daddy.” I paid my last respects to the great man whom I dearly miss. I drank a few pints of the black stuff in his honour (even though he was more of a Harp man) at the wake in his nephew’s pub The Sir Robert Peel in Queens Park. I was just so glad that Claire and Shimmies and I had made it to Al and Gil’s wedding earlier in the year where we got chance to see him for the last time.

the land of the giants 

a song about ancient aliens called; "the big picture"

Hiya fortean folks!

I have recorded a new song about ancient aliens called the big picture.

It's a song of hope in desperate times and just maybe one day the mothership will return!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UWygh5qpfTA

The Night I Slept In Scully's bed

Yay my debut book is out now. It's called; "Weird - The Life And Times Of A Pocket God" and as well as being about my time in music it's also about all the weird Fortean stuff that's happened to me along the way.
You can find out more about it here;

http://www.lulu.com/product/paperback/weird---the-life-and-times-of-a-pocket-god/18722334

THE NIGHT I SLEPT IN SCULLY’S BED & JAMMIN’ WITH THE JESUS & MARY CHAIN

“My McCartney bass lines are lost in the fuzz, pure white noise and a rock and roll buzz”

“The Jesus And Mary Chain” by The Pocket Gods

Y

es it’s true kind of. I was still living in that great sweaty mass of energy they call London and had made friends with an American couple, Bob and Carol from Boston. I had met them through my other American friends Dave and Sheri whom I met whilst living in Hungary, and that folks is a whole other book. Anyway they had come to a few of the last High Ones gigs and they thought that I was some sort of pop star.  I was flattered by their attention. They both were well educated Harvard graduates who now worked for that bastion of English small worldliness, The Daily Mail. They had that East Coast intellectual diffident vibe which was coasts apart from the West Coast ‘erbal new agers. They invited me to parties and to gigs and I guess I was their pet Brit pop star “bitch” that they paraded in front of their fellow Bostonian ex pats.

I did wonder whether they were in a cult at one stage, maybe Scientologists or Skulls and Bones Alumni but nothing weird happened, until the last night, just lots of Chablis, cous cous, and baseball guff. The last time I saw them was at their leaving party at their posh house in Crouch End. I had never been to their house before but had heard good things about it. Don’t forget I was living in a sub-let council flat 6 foot by 10 foot surrounded by North London White Trash. I got there and they were pleased to see me. They introduced me to the people I hadn’t already met, and re-introduced me to the people that I should have remembered but didn’t, probably because I was just too pissed the last time I met them that the memory was none more blank.

Carol showed me around the house and there was one weird moment when she asked me to come up stairs with her. I thought fuck she’s making a move on me…you see readers nothing scared me more than an attractive assertive woman who fancied me making a move on me…ever since my childhood I had avoided any sexual relations with anyone as I was scarred big time and it was best avoided at all costs…it took me 15 or more years before I had any confidence in myself and managed to patiently build a loving sex life with my now wife Claire Pocket…the only girlfriend I had was Vicky but let’s not go there just yet…

So Carol took me upstairs, but after a longing look into my eyes, she decided (probably after seeing the fear and dread deep in my icey blue eyes) just to show me around as opposed to showing me a good time…first of all she took me into this bedroom and then said to me; “you know of course this used to be Gillian’s room”…I thought so what who the fuck is Gillian but just said; “oh that’s nice”…she said; “you know that this house belongs to Gillian Anderson’s Mum and that Gillian, who’s Scully from the X files, grew up here before she moved to the States. We’re friends of her family and we’re renting it off them whilst we’re over here. You know Mark they’re looking for a new tenant so if you like I’ll put a good word in for you.”…I was just flabbergasted not only was I a massive X flies fan (that’s how we spell it in Sandringtons) I also fancied Scully, in a non sexual way of course, and Mulder was my hero….a loner, sad but driven and always searching for the truth….he was like me but braver. I knew part of me wanted to out my truth…..but I just didn’t have the strength to face what happened…just as Mulder always struggled reliving the day his sister disappeared….anyway it was well exciting being in Gillian Anderson’s house and I thought “wow I’ve got another name to drop now just wait till I tell everyone!”

We went back downstairs and I got a curious look from Bob and I felt like saying it’s ok mate I didn’t shag your wife, but I didn’t. We all just drank some more and then some more. They then started playing my High Ones CD to everyone telling everyone how talented I was. I was a bit drunk and morose by then and slurringly told them that the band was nearly finished and I didn’t know what to do as I had no other bands or projects lined up. It was time for another weird moment as Carol popped up and said; “Well Mark can you play bass guitar?” I thought can The Pope do a Hail Mary “Yes I can fuckin’ play bass” I replied. She then said; “have you heard of a band called The Jesus and Mary Chain as they’re friends of mine and they’re looking for a new bass player. Would you like me to get you audition?” “FUCK FUCKN FUCKN NORA BATTY” my drunk tourettes was OUT OF CONTROL. “YES FUCKING PLEASE I’LL HAVE AN AUDITION”….

JAMC were a fuckin cool indie band who were famous for playing gigs for 20 minutes and causing riots. They were like the Sex Pistols of the 80’s but indie kids. I didn’t know that they were still going but it would be an experience and after all I didn’t have much else to do.  I was well wasted but needed more booze to calm down and I got so calm that I fell asleep. I woke up in the early hours of the morning as I got a flash of dawn’s crack and thought; “where the fuck am I?” I was in fact sleeping fully clothed in Gillian Anderson’s bed….well the bed in her old room which was cool, until I realised that she would have been about 10 at the time and that was just weird and wrong.

Carol asked Gillian’s mum about letting the house to me but apparently she wasn’t keen on having a single musician bloke with not great personal hygiene and limited social skills living in her beautiful 3 storey Victorian house….which was a shame and I was thinking I should have had a wank in that bed while I had the chance….aside - even though I avoided all sexual relationships I knew that I wasn’t gay and that the natural Marky deep inside me fancied women as when I had a wank which wasn’t very often I would fantasize about women.

Well as for the JAMC Carol made a call the following day and I got a call from Jim Reid, one of the Scots brothers in the band, who asked me a few things about myself and told me they were looking to put together a new line up and were looking for a bass player. He said he’d send a tape in the post and if I could have a listen and then come in for an audition at their studio next Thursday that would be great …wow!

So I got the tape but big problem I didn’t have a bass…Jim from the High Ones didn’t fancy lending me his bass so I asked my old mate Bill Johnson (see - he pops up quite a lot in this story) and asked if I could borrow his precious Guild Bass….which he did, once I told him what it was for. “Just look after her she’s a special lady” Bill told me…she was and I did…

So I’d been jamming away to the tape for a few days and had all the songs sussed - this after all was the JAMC famous for their 3 chord songs…and I got carried away adding extra notes and giving the bass lines a nice McCartney veneer. He was after all my favourite bass player of all time. Those counter point melodies made a lot of Beatles songs into classics…RAIN anyone?  The greatest B side of all time. Anyway I was ready to Rock and kick out the JAMS motherfucker and off I trotted to the scary world South of The River...

The audition was at their own studio appropriately called “THE DRUGSTORE” in South London so I got the tube down to the Elephant & Castle. I was trying to relax as I was a bit nervous so decided to walk the last bit instead of getting the bus…..this was another big shot at the big time maybe, but after the letdown of the Shitfield battle of the bands I was a little more laidback about what might happen…I didn’t want to get my hopes up too much but let’s just say I was getting ready to shout at the world and  more importantly my parents – “FUCK YOU, I MADE IT!”

Anyway I had my converse boots on and my very old Sonic Youth T Shirt and was looking good! I got to the studio on time and pressed the buzzer…and pressed the buzzer again….no answer…well I guess this is the JAMC and I probably lost marks for arriving on time…40 minutes later one of the band turns up saying; “You’re a bit early shall we go in?”

So we did – WOW WOW WOW what a fucking studio, this was ace…their famous amps were there with “WILLIAM” and “JIM” written on them in big white letters….and there was ROCK N ROLL STUFF everywhere like Bottles of Jack Daniels, big Fuck off Sofas (obviously to entertain the groupies) and tons of cool guitars…they tried to make me feel at home and told me what was going to happen. They were going to record my audition so that they could play it back and have a listen…I stepped into the bass booth and turned on the amp adjusting the volume to what I thought was a nice level…Jim came running in saying louder, louder and cranked it up past 11. He also kicked on a fuzz pedal so basically it was just white noise…..cool!  I jammed along note perfect to all the toons but my kinda complex groovy bass lines got lost in the fuzz.

Oh well I gave it my best shot….I was waved into the sound booth where the guys had been listening. They said it sounded good and then Ben the guitarist was asking me what I’d done with the bass lines as they sounded more interesting than what he played on the original demo…I just waffled  back some incoherent nonsense about chords and minor thirds…I was star struck…..next stop PUB….

We all went off for a drink and a chat at their local….me on Stella whilst the rest of the band were on either Herbal Tea or Mineral Water…..to which I wasn’t impressed…they were kinda quiet and morose as well and the only time they got animated at all was when I asked them what they were doing at the weekend. They all looked very excited and told me they were going to watch the Chelsea - Man U game with Alan McGee in his private box. They said they go and watch all their home games in his big fuck off box. Corporate JAMC, teetotal, boring…this was a major disappointment to me and though I knew they were older than they were at their peak…I’d seen more life and rock n roll spirit at bingo hour in my evils Nan’s old folks home. However, I still wanted the job so pretended that I was having a good time hanging out with the JAMC. We then went our separate ways; they went off to bed…well it was 8pm…and me back to the Islington dive….they said they would call….they never did. Another chance to hit the big time gone gone gone ….but I later found out that the band never reformed and I guess all good things come to an end….like my band at the time The High Ones…

I recently wrote a song about my all too brief time with The Jesus and Mary Chain imaginatively called The Jesus and Mary Chain. It’s over 6 minutes long and has 3 chords in it. I’m not sure if it’s a work of art or just crap and I guess that’s what I think about everything I write. Is it good or am I just mad and untalented? Am I the Ed Wood of indie pop? These are the questions I keep asking myself but my ego always takes over and keeps my rock star dreams alive.

Dig This Real: Read This...

Dig This Real: Read This...: 2012 has started with much excitement here at DTR. Our Editor-at-Large, MC Lee has dropped his first book and if you are like me and just ...

Songs Of The Holy Grail And The End Of The World

 

My Fortean Opus - Songs Of The Holy Grail And The End Of The World - has been entered into the grammys for this year under Best Alternative Album...which is way cool...

I had fun recording this album at home, especially as it's a triple album featuring 30 songs on everything from Alchemy (Paracelsus) and the Rennes Les Chateau mystery to UFOs and end of the world prophecies. It's random and lo-fi, as all pocket gods releases are, and probably doesn't stand too much of a chance against our competition for the grammy - Radiohead, Elbow, PJ Harvey and Iron And Winde...but then again did any of them write a song about the knights templar hanging out at my local?

Should you wish you can buy the album from all major digital download stores - here is a link to the album in I tunes;
songs of the holy grail and the end of the world by the pocket gods

There is also a song on there called thetombman which is about Ben Hammott - who was featured in the ace film - Bloodline - by Bruce Burgess. Ben allegedly found a knights templar tomb near Rennes Les Chateau which may even be the tomb of Mary Magdalene.

Here is a link to the leaked grammy entry list for best alternative album which has the pocket gods at no. 75.
I also contacted Paddy Power bookmakers to see what our odds were of winning the grammy. They went away and did some calculations and got back to me with a price of 50 to 1! Which is not bad and they are the same odds for either Arsenal or Spurs to win this seasons Premier League title.

grammy entry list.